Today we take a deeper dive into – us! We interview each other about our origin stories, describing how we decided to follow our own advice to get informed and get involved.
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Transcript
JL: Hi, Ann Arbor AFers. This is cohost Jess Letaw with one more thing. We’ve been talking at you for months – now we’d like to hear from you! What do you like about the pod? What do you wish we were doing more of, or better? What ideas do you have for future episodes? We’ve put up a survey for you to fill out. There’s a link to it in the show notes, or go to annarboraf.com/survey. That’s annarboraf.com/survey. Send us your thoughts, questions, feels and feedback on the pod so far; we want to hear it all. And as always, get informed, then get involved. It’s your city!
Hi, and welcome to this episode of Ann Arbor AF, a podcast for folks trying to figure out what’s going on in Ann Arbor. We discuss current events in local politics and policy, governance, and other civic good times. I’m Jess Letaw and my pronouns are she/her, I’m Molly Kleinman and my pronouns are she/her, and I’m Michelle Hughes and my pronouns are she/her. We’re your cohosts to help you get informed, and get involved. It’s your city!
Today we’re taking a deeper dive into us we’re interviewing each other about our origin stories and civic hopes and explain why we decided to follow along and get more involved.
So my first question for you guys is what brought you to Ann arbor from the last place you lived because none of us are from here right.
Right.
MH: i’ll go.
I just came here for school I came here, for I grew up in the in the east lansing area and I came to Ann arbor for school and I stayed here, I think.
Mostly because there’s so many things you can do without using a car.
MK: I came here. For graduate school from Philadelphia well yeah I think I was in philly before I came here phillies where i’m from originally I lived a few other east coast places after that um.
And I thought I was going to come here and do my two year master’s degree and go back East and then never leave and instead I stayed forever and i’m probably never leaving here, at least not until my kids are grown so.
yeah that’s that’s where my story was what about you jess.
JL: i’m here for school and I picked it because my partner, and I, at the time were looking for places that were lesbian friendly and Ann arbor just kept surfacing as a place that would be safe and enjoyable to live.
My other requirements were must have municipal recycling program must be able to live there without a car and Oh, it had to have whether that was different from Georgia like it doesn’t have to be all snow all the time.
But if you could just not be swamped.
That would be great.
And, and our.
Ann arbor hit all those boxes.
MK: came here, I feel like I came here, in spite of the weather.
JL: For a lot of people.
MK: Everywhere else I applied to Grad school was Philadelphia, or even farther South and I wanted warmer weather, I thought, maybe I get to go to Austin.
MK: And instead I ended up here, which I think was a good fit it’s funny just because I also wanted to be in a place where I felt like I would be safe, as a career woman and like visibly clear, and I think that has mostly ended up being true of my experience in Ann arbor.
MK: But it’s funny about how how invisible that part of my life is now, I would say.
JL: yeah right.
MK: But it doesn’t matter.
MH: i’ve gotten a lot more physically clear lately.
No, I was clear.
JL: I always wished, I was clear, and then I found out, I was.
going through the whole evolution it’s Nice.
MK: So I think i’m next with the questions, which is what is your route or basically why or how did you get into local politics.
JL: So for me i’ll say that i’ve been paying attention to local politics for a lot longer than I was active.
And it was more has a source of entertainment slash, why are they getting everything wrong right, so I would read the news be like.
that’s ridiculous if only they listen to me everybody everything would make a lot more sense.
And then, after the 2016 election when I like a lot of other especially white people, I think, had to confront that I was living in a different country than I thought I was.
I had to find a way to take action, that a would manifest and change and be not constantly burn me out all the time, like I needed a place where I could make change and a scale, where I can make change.
At that time, Mary Morgan was living in the city, who was previously an editor and writer writer for the Ann arbor Chronicle and ran the civics nonprofits city initiative for a while.
And she was the first person I heard, although definitely not the last by now, who said that all politics is local and when I looked at it, I realized that everything that I care about.
Whether it’s equity sustainable buildings, how we care for each other as humans is tended to at the local level so that’s where I came from.
i’m not even sure.
MH: So.
I always just felt like I should be involved, but I never like felt like I was qualified to be involved, you know.
I had little spurts you know, not the whole time I lived here, I had little spurts of being a paying attention to city council or getting involved in one issue or another, there was a.
Back in 2003 there was a thing of they’ve changed the law where they were gonna.
It used to be illegal to panhandle in a way that makes someone feel intimidated threatened or harassed, but they changed a lot in 2003 so it’s.
So it would it was illegal to panhandle in a way that might make a reasonable person feel intimidated or threatened or harassed, which meant that the COPs had wider.
You know wider powers to hassle people who were out panhandling and I didn’t like that and I organized lunch, I like went out onto the streets and got a bunch of people to like come and speak at that.
public hearing about that and it just happened to be the public hearing where they were.
passing a resolution saying that the police would not are saying that the city would not.
cooperate with immigration stuff back in 2003 they redid it in 2017 to make it more explicit but they didn’t 2003 and a in a meeting that I just happened to show up back so I didn’t know what was going on but.
yeah, then I kind of went back to feeling like I wasn’t qualified to be involved, for a long time until the.
yeah I guess 2016 and started to feel like.
You need to be involved, even if you’re not qualified between false maybe the people who aren’t qualified to be involved with the people who should be involved, I don’t know.
and
I was real sick of how.
You know I had all these friends from living in the co OPS, all these friends from college and everybody had to move away.
And all the queer people that I knew how all they all had to move away because it just gets more and more expensive here and it’s been happening for a really long time, and I wanted to do something about housing prices and.
I just one day I just was depressed on the couch like it like normal and then one day I just jumped up and I was like i’m gonna print some stuff off my printer and run for city council.
I wasn’t expecting anyone to take me seriously, I was expecting just like i’ll take the dog for a walk and hand out some flyers while I was out there, but then, after a while people started taking me seriously and I was like wait me.
So, then, I was like well, maybe I do have something to offer, and so I stayed involved and started commentating on on city matters and yeah definitely yeah.
Definitely, a good time.
molly.
MK: So yeah for me i’ve been involved or engaging or trying to be involved on.
sort of national political.
Issues for kind of my whole adult life I drove down to DC to protest at bush’s inauguration and protested the Iraq war, and it wasn’t it was it’s truly whether bees fault.
I.
Julie.
MK: Thank you Julie.
I had helped start common cycle, which is our local bike nonprofit and i’ve been involved.
On the like in the early days of common cycle and then Julie knew that there were some openings on the transportation Commission and she reached out to me.
To see if I would be interested in being on the transportation Commission I had never I had no idea what the Commission really did I had never watched or listened to a meeting but.
It felt like a dream come true, for me, which I guess is an extremely nerdy thing to admit, but you know i’d like I would be biking around town and imagining you know how I would make.
The streets better for bikes if it was up to me and I was like you mean it could be kind of it could be on a Commission and have some say, and not just felt really exciting and then.
That was in August I was appointed in August of 2018, which is also the month that the the power on Council changed hands and we had folks.
On Council who were opposed to things like bike lanes and crosswalk safety and that I think was the point at which I went from like oh i’m just here for the bike lanes to sort of on fire and ready to really do some damage.
And then I yeah and then it’s just sort of all been downhill from there, I guess.
MH: Well downhill is good when you’re on a bike.
MK: True very true.
MH: So okay Okay, but my question is, and I think just sort of answered it, but what, why did you get involved in city government and that some other level, a lot of people get interested in the.
state and federal lot of people yell at what the President does, but what got you interested in local politics.
Just.
JL: Specifically, the things that I care about a lot of it is regulated at the local level, I care about land use.
And how buildings get used, and that is specifically that specifically belongs to the city, there are elements of it that, especially in.
Where we live a little bit belongs to Washington county a little bit more belongs to the state of Michigan, but if you care about how land gets us you pay attention to the city.
There are other elements that are that I do care about that are less controlled by the city, but are executed by the city so, for example.
Sustainability has been professional and personal focus of mine, for a long time we don’t regulate we look, by and large, do not have environmental regulations, we have the clean water Act and the Clean Air act.
Excuse me at the federal level, we have the Great Lakes environmental body which used to be the dq department of environmental quality, and I can never remember what eagle stands for, although I love that that’s the name now anyway.
that’s the state level we really don’t have that at the city level, but we do have how building codes get interpreted, we have we decide how we’re going to use our street and sidewalk right, so I never sure if its rights of way or right of ways things right ways.
in ways that encourage non motorized transit so for the things that I care about those decisions are made at City Hall, a few streets away from me and so that’s why local for me.
MK: And just you.
actually have a plan, a degree and planning right, this was I have sort of a bonus question, which is about the you have training in this and i’m curious about what brought you to to that sort of professional path to.
JL: I wanted to be an architect, when I was nine and I was getting ready to graduate with my undergraduate degree in German linguistics.
When I was 29 and was at.
The watershed moment where I needed to decide if you speak another language it’s teaching or translating basically.
Unless you get into a specific you know manufacturing or business area and I neither wanted to teach North translate, and so I had to come up with Plan B really quickly.
And so I asked that question that like therapists and business coaches tell us to ask what would your inner child want to do in my inner child wanted to be an astronaut ballerina vet architect and.
Out of all of those things architect was still on the table so that’s what I went to school for, and it was super challenging it was really fun in retrospect.
German linguistics and architecture are both about the study of connection how we relate to each other how space relates to people, this is like a decade of post rationalization so I.
can say it now, at the time I was just like I don’t know this seems cool.
But what it means is that I have deeply studied both communication and place and i’m really interested in not only how they relate, but how they fail us and how we could do better.
awesome.
MK: Was it my turn to me.
MH: Oh i’m not sure.
Why city level.
MK: So yeah I think I definitely felt like I was getting tired of bashing my head against national politics right it didn’t feel like I had nearly as much power to make an impact.
And then you know transportation is sort of the issue that got me.
Like the looped me in and that’s so much of transportation policy is local is very local and then.
it’s also.
been a great way to connect with people who are sort of earnest nerds in the same way that I am an earnest nerd about stuff and that has helped make Ann arbor.
A friendlier place to live, one of my ongoing challenges living here, Michelle you mentioned all your friends, leaving.
I i’ve spent so much time affiliated with the university in one way or another, and so i’m i’ve been through like five or six rounds of friends who.
graduate and leave or get promoted, you know professionally want to move up and leave and.
Finding people who really care about the city politics, those are mostly people who are sticking around and so that’s been really nice for me that’s not why I got into city politics but it’s I think it’s definitely part of why I had stayed engaged.
JL: I do want to pirate that part of the answer because caring about local politics brings me into Community with people that I deeply enjoyed What did you say Ernest nerds.
Yet spot on.
I think that’s a great descriptor of all of us to yeah.
MK: What about you, Joe.
MH: yeah why local politics is yeah I think the things that I cared about you know, affordable housing and.
doing something about the police, making sure that they’re.
That we’re not suffering that our communities aren’t suffering from police brutality, those are both things that happened at the local level and.
So you know getting involved at the State level to try to fix the housing problems that are very specific to Ann arbor you know, even if I talk to other people from other cities in Michigan like.
Their their whole like affordable housing situation is just you know they have different problems they have different solutions and like.
i’m used to what goes on here and I understand what goes on here and I feel very culturally connected to what goes on here, whereas like, even if I were to get involved in politics at the county level I don’t know much about what goes on in saline you know, like.
So yeah both the problems and the cultural connection, and I think the the size and scale of the problem, like, I can.
If I were to get involved in trying to get medicare for all to happen it’s just like.
Who boy I mean I really want that to happen, but how do I even like what’s the difference if i’m one more drop in the ocean, or you know, but I guess you got to have those those drops or the ocean will be empty.
I find it a lot more sustaining to like feel like I can get my head around what’s going on and.
That I can talk to people about it in a way that makes a difference.
JL: Look, both yells answers, yes, just did a.
So at this point, you guys have been are all of us, I guess, have been involved for several years.
Bali may beat us all at being an activist, for most for grownup life Michelle you came in quite a while ago, but then said, you know it’s really a few years ago that you got kind of that.
level set and, for me, I, as I said, I was paying attention much longer than I was active what’s something that you’ve changed your mind about because or since you got more deeply involved and i’ll start with Michelle on that yeah.
MH: Well, I think.
When I first got involved, my main thing was that I want there to be affordable housing and kind of the only solution, I had envisioned was public housing.
I wanted to make sure that we were building public housing and then you know the city with be able to set some of it to be affordable, at a certain level.
And you know have some other housing that could be rent controlled in some way or something like that, but that wasn’t necessarily means tested that’s that was That was my first That was my first vision.
And when I.
People kept wanting me to take a stand, one way or another, about like Okay, but should we.
have more market rate housing or should we have less market rate housing like what should we do with you know zoning and I was kind of like let’s just do Can we just talk about public housing for a second.
Because like to me it was like you know the factions in town didn’t seem like either one of them were getting very much done and one one was into doing less.
You know one was doing less market rate housing and ones into doing more market rate housing and it didn’t really seem to me like either one was getting anything done so.
I thought I could come in with a new idea which is let’s focus on public housing, but since i’ve paid more attention and read more articles and seen more about what’s going on, like.
The doing the private market rate housing really seems like.
there’s it’s.
Like there’s no way to get around that that’s a really good thing to do, like we just.
You know, we can’t public housing our way out of it because we just don’t have the funds available, but to build housing on the scale that we need to do it if we have the ability to like.
grab a whole bunch of money out of nowhere and build a whole bunch of public housing, that would be great, but like.
We.
But yeah The thing that i’m The thing that i’ve become convinced of because of my involvement is that we really need to focus on having more housing of any kind, no matter what it is, even if its market rate private housing, but it will help that it will be helpful so that’s yeah that’s.
JL: that’s an interesting point thanks, what about you man.
MK: So you know, I was thinking about it, and I think in terms of local issues, I was having trouble thinking of things i’ve changed my mind about, because I think there was so much where I didn’t have an opinion at all.
On the local level, I didn’t I certainly hadn’t thought enough about housing to understand the relative pros and cons of public housing versus market rate housing and why you might want one and not the other, so I didn’t.
There are a lot of things I have opinions about and how that I didn’t before the more deeply involved that I get I I think I I came in as a bike key person right that was sort of.
What I cared about, but I.
I want so much more I think if anything i’ve gotten more and more radical, the more involved i’ve gotten about what I think is a reasonable goal, and what I think is acceptable so where i’m from you couldn’t bike on the road safely, there were there was no space.
There was no visibility it wasn’t it really would not have worked.
And pretty much no one did it and so coming here and having bike lanes just paint just paint on the road and that little space that was for you on a bicycle that to me felt amazing.
And I was biking for transportation, for the first time in my life, despite having grown up doing bike stuff with my family.
But the more i’ve learned the more I recognize the paint is not enough paint isn’t even close to enough.
there’s so much more that we can be doing to reconfigure our our roads in our spaces for four people and human scale life so it’s more I guess about radicalization, the more the more involved, I get the more.
The bigger the changes that I want, which is maybe backwards, since it’s harder to get bigger changes, what about you jess.
JL: In thinking about this question what comes to mind isn’t how i’ve changed my mind about an issue but i’ve changed my understanding of how people engage.
I think when I first started getting involved I assumed a I assumed that everybody knew more than me about whatever the issue was on the table and I assumed that everybody was making good faith arguments from the same set of information.
I don’t think any of those things.
But i’m not saying that i’m cynical what i’m saying is that.
A lot of times people hold opinions that they don’t interrogate.
Right, so we say things like i’m all for housing I just think that this is a terrible location and they point to genuine pain points like.
How many times that intersection has flooded in the last six months, or how bad the traffic is how unsafe, it is for children to navigate around on footer on bike.
And what folks don’t have an awareness of I think is a that we have traffic and water engineers to actually assess safety and climate mitigation impacts and be.
That our world is not the world, and what i’m saying is that a decision that we make thinking about our neighborhood doesn’t necessarily make sense in the context of a city or a county or region.
Michelle was talking about the different types of housing that’s I think a really important point and we’ll get into that more this fall.
I think a little bit more about if I want to be kind to my lower town neighbors or my Packard neighbors or my ypsilanti neighbors or my Detroit neighbors i’ll say yes to a little bit more housing to.
Take more cars off the.
Road to get us closer to where we work and go to school and have fun.
That context, I think, is often missing I don’t necessarily think it’s bad faith it’s just hard to come to the table with perfect information and perfect context and that’s what i’ve changed my perspective on is that people mean well and bring a lot of feelings, but may not have context.
yeah.
I think that’s a really good observation.
So what are.
Your goals, this is for.
Both of you obviously so what what are your policy objectives in life so some concrete problems that you want to whittle away at.
So we’re not talking vague like make Ann arbor better, but what are some measure of like what is the measurable thing that you would like to change and Michelle i’m gonna ask you first.
MH: i’m going to go with affordable housing I want I want.
The city to be.
a place where people can live, where people don’t have to live an hour by bus away and then have to take the bus into town all the time I don’t want this to be a place where.
People graduate and then move to a place that’s easier to live I want this to be a place where people can afford to live and all different types of people.
So yeah affordable housing.
I also would like to do something about the police, and what I want the police to be done differently, and what public safety to be done differently, I want us to defend the police and fun to some sort of.
alternative approach to public safety.
And yeah I definitely want us to do.
favor.
card, you know not favorite car infrastructure have a favorite car free infrastructure, I want us to favor.
bicycle and pedestrian pipe infrastructure and.
I want us to be building more densely so that to in order to make it easier to run buses, we want more buses and.
Yes, I think all those things are going to make it.
Just a lot easier to breathe in Ann arbor I think there’s a lot of like.
You know that it’s.
Like to stay in Ann arbor is pretty tense, sometimes, because if you.
aren’t in the best economic situation you’re really scrambling.
And I want us to have the breathing room to have some of the weird stuff that people remember from Ann arbor and you know, sometimes people think that’s going away because of this, and that and this and that reason, but I think the main problem is the housing prices right.
MK: yeah.
Just what about you.
JL: So for me and i’m not looking at a manifesto that i’ve written or anything.
I have, I do have.
Some concrete goals on housing in general.
In Washington county’s 2015 housing affordability and economic equity report the they made a number of recommendations for the city of Ann arbor three at high impact and one low impact.
That out of the 10 they recommended the city either hasn’t touched her hasn’t made meaningful progress on so I want to see us.
complete the recommendations made in that report that’s housing in general, when it comes to affordable housing, I want to see two things first of all, the city needs.
A 20 to 30 year affordable housing plan right now we’ve got funds coming out of a millage that was approved by voters last November, thanks again voters.
So we’ve got money to do things and we’ve got quite a long to do list there’s there’s plenty to do with land that the city already.
owns but Jennifer Hall, the head of the affordable housing Commission or Ann arbor housing Commission excuse me.
is very clear in saying that, even with all that money and all that land.
they’re only touching they’re only going to be able to create a create a third at best.
Of the units that we knew we needed six years ago, we still need an updated inventory and we need a plan for closing that gap.
So I want to see that happen, and as a part of that I want to see the city dedicate general fund dollars to this so that we’re not constantly going back to the public for additional taxes.
Absolutely, I think the public should support meaningfully and financially are affordable housing commitment I also think that this should just be a bedrock funding commitment in our city’s general budget.
I like Michelle would like to see changes happen with the police my specific ask is around the Labor contract.
I feel like a lot of that happens way outside of the public view and specifically with respect to the police budget, which has seemed like a black box so i’d like to see that change.
and the last thing that i’ll say for now.
Is that I want to see a meaningful demonstrable with teeth citywide commitment to racial equity, we have seen over and over and over again.
How white blindness, or worse, white terrorism can cause problems in and around the city and we’ve also seen well intentioned white people.
kind of weaponized in the language of injustice and oppression in service of ideas that really have to do with comfort and fairness.
it’s not the same and and we need to be held accountable for not doing that so i’m looking forward to seeing our city get way more serious about our work around race and equity in general.
MK: So i’m just going to say what you both said, those are a lot of those are also my goals, a couple things i’ve been.
In particular, have been thinking about.
Lately, so i’ve been thinking about re envisioning public safety.
In the city and in the county and what a vision for for safety looks like that doesn’t involve police and all the other work and building that we have to do.
To to get to safety and and safety for everyone it’s it comes back I think two of those the taking seriously racial equity that you were talking about just.
I think it’s kind of related to that honestly i’ve been thinking, a lot more about our regional connectivity and how we can get people to in from Detroit and ypsilanti and all of our surrounding areas without cars, I think we have so far to go and it’s.
This is a huge uphill battle sort of at the state level in terms of making.
To make real strides in that in that space, but I think it’s I think it’s so important because I also like Michelle I want my friends to be able to live here, you know some of my favorite people.
stayed in the region, but they’re not an Ann arbor because it was too.
expensive and.
So then getting to them and getting them to hear all it’s all it’s also interconnected I think that’s Another thing I really well we’ll get there in a minute.
So I think that probably is as good as i’m going to get for policy objectives today.
MH: softball question marks, which is what makes political involvement fulfilling and satisfying for you what keeps you activated what keeps you coming back.
JL: man.
I know that the question is what makes my political involvement fulfilling and satisfying but in general it’s watching other people engaged.
Like trisha duckworth and crystal dupree and you both.
And I i’m I know that there are folks all over the city all over the country to but all over the city, who care about this community and who advocate for it in totally different ways than I would in sometimes for different things than I would but.
The one of the things that keeps my energy refresh just a reminder that i’m not the only one.
That there is a community of care here for each other and for the Community itself, and that that feeds me seeing other people get excited and angry right like love and rages what we talked about on this podcast.
Is 11 rage and other people and.
And there’s feeds me, I will say that another really important part and I don’t think we talked about this enough is rest enjoy.
I don’t assume that the work is never done, I have a very specific practice of at the end of every day deciding when done is.
And when i’m done i’m done not gonna say I stopped thinking about things that’s I think impossible, but I stopped working on things, and I do prioritize.
rest, which is both sleep and activities other than working on change and joy.
Sharing food with other people share music with other people bike rides petting other people’s dogs until I get my own puppy like all of these things that make me happy.
feed the energy that goes into pouring into the black hole, that is, you know, a changed future so that’s what keeps me going What about you, Michelle.
MH: um yeah I think that yeah I think the Community is a big part of it, like I get involved, I say what I think and I see other people, you know getting involved in the same way, I learned from them, I.
have fun with them, we crack weird inside jokes where you have to have seen the last three City Council meetings and.
JL: I love.
Like.
MH: yeah I mean it feels not just important but fun and if it doesn’t feel fun then there’s no way I could stay.
MK: involved in it and.
MH: So you know I hope to make it fun for other people.
Because I know that that’s that you know, being in a Community where people are having fun talking about city, politics is what makes it fun for me.
yeah and and.
I also feel like I.
have an effect i’ve seen sometimes that, like the words you know, like i’ll i’ll i’ll say some phrase when i’m like talking about an issue and then i’ll see other people use that same phrase like Oh, I did that.
I don’t think I can do that on the national level, you know.
JL: It is, it is quite a feeling when.
When you see different ways that your work has an effect.
MH: That is.
JL: That is really something right.
MH: i’m molly What about you.
MK: i’m sitting here, trying to find an exact quote and i’m not going to find it but there’s a line that I think comes from merriam Kaaba which is basically anything worth doing is worth doing with other people and that’s, I think, been a big.
Part of it, for me, I think YouTube both said similar things that the the working with other folks and meeting and connecting with other folks is is the thing that helps me keep the love and the rage in balance.
Because it’s easy.
to let the rage.
take over and and burn too hot first to be sustainable, not like in terms of greenhouse gases, but like a double for my own.
My own self.
JL: I don’t know I think Ray just bad for the planet.
I think I think the right amount of rage is productive for the right amount of rage right yes.
MK: Because it’s sometimes that’s what it takes to get people out of their seats and doing.
That string.
So I yeah, I think, for me, a lot of it comes down to the those connections and the the Internet snark I don’t think i’m this time I did this, as some of the reasons you gave jess I like I do I, like the.
The snark and the the jokes that develop on the bay to counsel hashtag among the folks who’ve been just so deep in this paying this kind of attention to this really very narrow thing.
that’s I think what helps to sort of keep me going and honestly, it is the the rage, is one of the things that keeps me going and my Jewish guilt there’s definitely i’m an ongoing I can’t I can’t stop it’s not allowed.
JL: So you have the Jewish guilt and I think partly my whiteness and my coming into consciousness as a white lady.
And what that means is definitely some of the rocket fuel like oh man there it’s I resist characterizing it as white guilt.
it’s not exactly what it is it’s a little bit what it is, but it’s not exactly what it is it’s more that I feel a sense of responsibility right like I have come into a system that is built to benefit me how can I do anything less than break it down.
MK: You know right.
JL: So on that note our final question for today it’s feels a little bit like therapy now something you’ve learned from doing this podcast and i’ll start with Michelle if you’re ready.
MH: well.
I would like to say.
That okay i’ll start with I i’ve come I come in here with the two of you who are both like very, very specifically involved and very like.
involved in kind of an expert way you’re both like on these committees and you do you know.
Here you are involved in a really deep way, whereas I feel like i’m involved in a really broad way and so it’s.
it’s kind of intimidating sometimes you know that, like.
JL: We can do amazing I totally feel the same way.
daunted.
By how much you pay attention to you and your memory.
Okay, so the mutual intimidation.
MH: yeah cuz like I think we’ve had whole episodes where it’s.
Just like it’s, just like the episode is just go.
JL: For an hour.
MH: don’t feel like there’s anything that I have the depth to do that with you know that I can just talk for an hour about a thing and.
I try to I try to make up for that, by bringing in guests from outside who are doing the work and so i’ve learned a lot from them.
and
But I think also like you to have also made me just like just like wow just talking about it now like you’ve made me realize that, like the stuff that I do is work.
Like.
I yeah I just thought I was messing around on Twitter, you know currently apparently like making the City Council packets digestible to people is something that.
people wanted done.
And it’s and people seem to like the way that I write about it.
So.
JL: it’s me, I am people.
MH: So yeah i’m.
But that’s what i’m trying to learn still is that my my involvement is valuable.
I don’t feel like a failure that yeah.
MK: One thing that I started I started learning this before the podcast but it’s really the podcast is really driven at home is how interconnected.
All of these different things that we care about are so we can fix transportation if we don’t fix land use and we can fix land use if we don’t fix.
The inequities and racial justice issues of the city like it’s all been some level it’s all the same problem.
And the the more different things we’ve focused in on in this podcast because i’ve learned a ton from the guests and i’ve just learned a lot from being into agendas and paying closer attention, but in some ways i’ve learned that all of our problems are one problem.
And what about you jess.
JL: that’s deep I love.
What is something i’ve learned, so I am really intrigued by the idea of how can we make it really easy to bring people into the set of conversation.
that’s why I started the conversation group and arbor humans who won’t.
that’s why I started a nonprofit building matters Ann arbor it’s why I joined the board of the DDA it’s why I asked you guys to do this podcast with me i’m really interested in how we get a lot of people in and effectively engaged.
So I am a little disappointed to report that one of the most meaningful lessons i’m taking i’m taking from this podcast.
Is that your advocacy on an issue benefits the longer you pay attention to it.
If you follow a resolution through its various committees and commissions if you engage with Community organizers and your neighbors and your City Council member and ask city staff about it.
The deeper you go on one specific issue, the more effectively you’ll be able to advocate for that.
And what I want is for everybody to be able to come to the table and like knock it out of the park civically.
The first time every time partly that’s true right like just showing up is huge and more than most people do.
But, like most relationships civics benefits from time and attention, and so one of the things that i’ve learned is that, following something following along with something over time, helps you helps it helps the city.
And it’s good lesson.
JL: So, speaking of paying attention to things over time, Michelle paid attention to something over time and learned a new thing.
MH: that’s right um so yeah we’re we’re we’re kind of done with the portion of the podcast which we are asking each other questions.
JL: You guys are super interesting, by the way, i’m glad we did this.
Yes.
MK: i’ve been thinking, like our listeners.
I feel like maybe they’re wondering who are we to be like, why should they listen to us like what are, who are Who are we to be doing this, and so I felt like maybe we can take a minute and and talk about.
who we are.
MH: To be doing i’m hoping.
i’m hoping that the lesson people drew from this was that, like we’re just people, you can do this, too, like, I was laying on the couch being depressed just like you.
JL: I was shaking my fist saying you’re doing it wrong, just like you.
MK: I was completely not clued in at all.
MH: All you gotta do is start paying attention and then you can start cracking hilarious jokes with people who will look.
MK: I do it for the means really.
JL: don’t we all really.
MH: And maybe you can affect some heavy to have a positive effect on the city way around.
JL: that’s right that’s right love rage social change and means that’s what we’re here.
MH: So Okay, so I wanted to talk about a correction i’m the last one, we talked about our budget wrap up and I talked about how.
difficult it was for me to understand where the budget deficit was.
I was looking in the documents I couldn’t find the budget deficit everyone’s been talking about the budget deficit, the whole conversation was guided by the budget deficit, where is the budget deficit, what is the.
How much is the budget deficit and I was frustrated with how the documents were written in a really kind of.
opaque way where.
Even someone who is as involved, as I am can’t just look at it and find the budget deficit well I texted Lisa dish.
My City Council REP one of them and.
and asked her what what’s what’s the deal, how do I find the budget deficit and she showed me that what I need to look at is.
That, if you look at the budget resolution from the.
May 17 meeting.
Right at the top, it says general fund activity, so this was DS one in the may 15 meeting on register.
And there’s there’s a few pdfs attached to it one of them is called the budget resolution what’s actually called him the link.
Resolution for fiscal year 22 proposed budget that PDF and there is a thing of this is general fund activities and it says.
It has these two he has the total revenues and total expenditures line I remarked on the last episode.
That those two lines were equal, so why is there a deficit, well, it turns out i’m only supposed to be paying attention to the recurring revenues and recurring expenditures, because when you subtract.
When you subtract those numbers and we find that we have 113 million dollars of recurring revenues and 115 million dollars of recurring expenditures, and so the the budget deficit is $1.7 million and.
The the non recurring it look the numbers look the same because the non recurring revenues are in there, this is things like drawing down from.
fund balances and things like that that you know we’re gonna we’re going to basically like pick spend, spend for our savings to make up the deficit, so that it looks equal on paper but.
They call it a structural deficit because it’s built in it’s it’s gonna.
We need, we need to solve that it’s not going to be, you know it’s not going to automatically be solved next year.
And so.
yeah that’s that’s how you find the deficit and it’s only in the general fund that this deficit is is noticeable and important because the.
All the other funds are managed and really specific ways, so that, like we know what the where the money’s coming from and it doesn’t fluctuate and we.
You know, are very strictly regulated and how we spend it so like things like the parks millage can only be spent on parks like revenue from water bills, can only be spent on water things and.
So the discretionary funding is all in the general fund and so that’s where the revenues and expand, you know that’s why that’s where the recurring revenues referring expenditures that’s what the deficit is so.
JL: I really appreciate you doing that homework, this goes back to.
The the first and persistent thing that I had raved about what the budget.
which had nothing to do with any of the dollar amounts and everything to do with how.
clergy and opaque, I found everything about the budget to be communicated, including the fact that, like he said, there was a lot of conversation in the air around deficit, but the word deficit does not find itself anywhere in the budget, and you had to make a phone call and figure.
MH: On with it was so control over that it’s not in their.
rights.
JL: So I it’s my hope for the future going.
Forward you Michelle had talked about better public engagement around the budget process and I.
MH: Think that’s.
JL: valuable and necessary I hope for better communications, I think, in this area, particularly we kind of can’t sink.
Too much energy into helping people understand if we really want people to get involved, we have to help them understand and how the budget is communicated currently is not geared for that kind of invitation.
MH: And like if it’s hard if it’s this hard for people that are involved as involved as us to understand like I don’t think we’re that different from the Council members themselves in how involved are so like.
You know they’re making they’re making decisions with about the same information that we are.
JL: And right.
MH: You know i’m having a hard time finding an understanding this stuff I have it’s it seems reasonable to believe that they also are having a difficult time understanding it to.
JL: Speaking of.
Collecting information, I want to thank everybody who’s been filling out the survey you guys have some really interesting answers you’ve also pointed out that there were a couple of technical problems with the forum Thank you fixed.
This is the last week of the survey, so if you haven’t filled it out yet please head over to our website and arbor af.com slash survey.
that’s Ann arbor af.com slash survey will drop a link in the show notes it’s quick easy for you and enormously helpful for us we’re already working on the next season of content, so let us know what you want to hear more of.
MK: Thank you to all of you who have donated on our coffee if you’d like to send us a few dollars to cover our hosting fees, you can find us at K oh dash F Ly calm slash Ann arbor a F.
JL: And you guys, this is it for this episode and this season of Ann arbor af we’re taking June off for the pods first break rerunning past episodes that you’ve told us are your favorites they’re ours to.
When we come back we’ll be doing Council only episodes for July and August and then returning in September for deeper dives and conversations with advocates around the Community.
If you’d like to find us for conversations about Council meetings in the meantime, please come to the Twitter hashtag which is hashtag a to cancel my saying that right.
and find us on Facebook at Ann arbor humans who want Michelle and hoping that you’ll be doing your threads for the Council agendas, even though we won’t be having.
MH: episodes i’ll have more energy to devote to that because I won’t have the podcast.
And I gotta say thoughts out somewhere.
JL: If you haven’t seen a Michelle Council thread you haven’t lived you need a Michelle Council thread in your life.
MH: Just telling you that now so.
JL: we’re your co hosts molly kleinman Michelle Hughes and myself chesley talk and thanks, as always, to our producer jack Jennings who stepping in for daredevil assign.
For questions about this podcast or ideas about future episodes you can email us at Ann arbor af pod at gmail COM, the music I don’t know by grapes get informed and get involved it’s your city.
MK: Have a good summer.