Today we are having a conversation with Alex Thomas about all things Ypsi Township.
Alex’s references:
– Liberate Don’t Incarcerate
– the 2015 study on housing affordability and economic equity in Washtenaw County
– the aborted move to rename Ypsi Township to Ford Lake Township
– the Observer article documenting the 86% of the township’s revenue that comes from law enforcement citations
– Washtenaw County commissioners (next election is 2022!)
He also hopes you’ll check out Ypsi Can I Share, a grassroots organization founded to encourage civic engagement; and the Human History of Ypsi Special for Black History Month; and an alternative, authentic perspective on Ypsi, What’s Left, for local grassroots online news.
Come check out our episodes and transcripts at our website, annarboraf.com. Keep the conversation going with fellow Ann Arbor AFers on Twitter and Facebook, or catch cohost Michelle with Council recaps and other civic goodies on wcbn.org Tuesdays 6am-9am. And hey, if you wanted to ko-fi us a few dollars to help us with hosting, we wouldn’t say no.
Transcript
NOTE: This version of the transcript was generated by an automated transcription tool and will contain (sometimes hilarious) errors. When we have time for human editing to clean this up we will update it, but we hope this imperfect version is better than nothing.
Jess (00:05):
Hi, and welcome to this episode of Ann Arbor af, a podcast for folks trying to figure out what’s going on in Ann Arbor. We discuss current events and local politics and policy governance and other civic good times. I’m Jess Leeta and my pronouns are she her. I’m Molly Kleinman and my pronouns are she her. And I’m Michelle Hughes and my pronouns are she her. We’re your co-hosts to help you get informed and get involved. It’s your city. Let’s jump in. Today we’re having a conversation with Alex Thomas about all things Ipsy Township and how Ann Arbor can continue to be better neighbors to our near neighbors there. And as always, with ideas to help you follow along and get more involved. Alex Thomas, welcome and thank you for joining us.
Alex (00:55):
Thank you, Jessica. Pleasure to be here.
Jess (00:57):
So can you tell us just a little bit about yourself, where you’re from and what brings you to this part of the world?
Alex (01:03):
Oh, happily. I’m first 52 years old. That’s important. It surprises a lot of people, but I put it out there because I came to Washington County, Atlan Township when I was seven years old. So I have a long association with the township and that perspective. I grew up here. My parents were auto workers, went to a lot of people don’t know, a good portion of Sey Township goes to Belleville schools. Belleville 87. I went to university, didn’t finish, and Louisiana came back here, spent some time in Vegas being a purchaser, I speeded up, did a lot of other things. But from 2004 to 2008, I was a financial aid counselor at the medical school in at U of M. And then in 2008 I went to China and taught English for eight years and I thought I’d be there for the next 20. But I returned here in 2016 to care for my mom and that’s what brought me here, brought me back.
Alex (02:05):
So that’s a lot in between there, but I think that’s just important to know that perspective. And being out of the country for eight years and coming back and just seeing the drastic change in Ypsilanti Township, Washington County from the community I grew up in and wanting to understand what were the reasons for what was happening to affect it, how it was understood. I say it was kind of like the frog in a increasing temperature pot. I came back with that eight, it was just hot. It’s like, wow, what is going on? Especially after spending eight years in Shanghai, just dynamic city, the expat community with that was extremely motivated. Everybody wanted to be there, having lots of fun and doing lots of things. And then they come here. So it was a really interesting perspective and that’s what led to my working in community advocacy. Just seeing that difference, seeing what the major issues were and trying to understand them and trying to affect them.
Alex (03:15):
That advocacy led to me joining my neighborhood association. I was an advisor to that, the new Westville Neighborhood Association. I’m a member, but I’m not an advisor member of their board. Part of, in that initial introduction I left thought I was one of Avalon Housing’s first tenants in 1992. I think I was the third one actually. I lived at 2 0 1 West William Corner. William and Ashley in downtown in Arbor, was there for five years and did some tenant organizing too, by the way, initially. But when I returned in 2016, I did some volunteer work with them, did some organizing at one of their properties. And that eventually led to, I’m on the Avalon Housing’s board in that advocacy, I started doing a regular podcast. First called it what Up in the Willow. I’m a community advocate for West Willow. It’s the largest neighborhood in Ypsilanti Township. And I always point out that Ypsilanti Townships second largest municipality in Washington County, say we’re the Rodney Dangerfield and municipalities people don’t know
Jess (04:19):
Well. And
Alex (04:20):
Actually 55,000.
Jess (04:22):
No, that leads into my next question. So you’re, you keep referencing Ypsilanti Township and I want you to help us understand the ypsilantis, right? Because I think a lot of folks aren’t aware that there’s more than one.
Alex (04:33):
Well, I think as with that association, when I say among my community, and it’s the African American, Eastern Washington people that live this area, Y P S I, Ipsy, and that Ipsy area comprises and touches for municipalities, the city of Ypsilanti, Ypsilanti City proper, which is about 20,000 people. And then Ypsilanti Township, which is the second largest municipality with about 55,000 people. And then you have Superior Township, which is about 13,000 I believe. And then Pittsfield Township also a good portion. I consider part of that ipsi, which is runs between Gulf side west of Gulf side to 23. So that area, and I think that’s the general concept in most people’s minds when they think, a lot of times you, you’ll ask, and this runs around classes, ethnic groups, income levels. I always like to ask a clerk somewhere at the UPS store across from Myers, are you in Ipsy or are you where do not, and they’re swearing there and no, this is Pitfield Township people don’t dunno. But so many times
Michelle (05:52):
People don’t think about the townships a lot. It just doesn’t, people think in terms of cities. Yeah,
Alex (05:59):
Huge. We have 26. I always municipalities a city, town or village, it’s so important. We have about 26 in Washington. Our county, Ann Arbor is the leading population wise, 120,000 about Ypsilanti Township number 2 55.
Jess (06:14):
That blew my mind the first time you told me that. 55,000 people. And I think that was the conversation that I learned that if he had a township, yeah.
Alex (06:23):
And I tell you, I just wanted to speak spontaneous. I didn’t do my homework fair. So I’m glad you jumped in, but because I could keep going. But I think the kind flow on this, what I point out in those numbers, how those really relate. When you think 55,000 Nipsey Township and it has a poverty rate of about 15%, and then you think the city of Ypsilanti you 20,000, it has a poverty rate of 31% or something. It comes out when those percentages and for whatever, there’s different measures for poverty, but just poverty or impoverished by those measures, generally that’s about 6,000 people in the city of Ypsilanti. It’s about 8,000 in Ypsilanti Township. And they’re about one exit away from each other. So when we think about how the importance of, look, the phrase all politics are local, is local government important? Does it matter? If you think it does, then you have to know where those borders are. And then if you live within them, you have to know what is your governing body. So many people that should know better don’t know that. Then when there’s an incident in Ypsilanti Township that Ypsilanti city council members of the community, but they don’t have immediate effect on it. That’s not in their jurisdiction. The George? Yeah, ahead Michelle. Oh,
Michelle (07:42):
Oh, I was just saying, I grew up in a place called OMI and I always thought there was an OMI government and that was a city, but it’s not at all. It was part of Meridian Township. And I just grew up not knowing that. Well, I think that’s kind of how a lot of people are.
Alex (07:58):
That’s been the story here. But just in recent times, just within 24 hours of George Floyd, there was a police brutality incident here in Ypsilanti Township having to do with Washington County Sheriff. And there was no quotation or no public comment from any Ypsilanti Township officials who all of law enforcement and Ypsilanti Township is by the Washington County Sheriff’s Department, which is contracted by Ypsilanti Township. So I saw some quotes on them live from FC City Council and some different council people. But that’s an example of how leaders and representatives of the second largest municipality in Washington County don’t have to be held accountable. People don’t know their names, don’t know who know they’re,
Michelle (08:47):
Can you tell us a little bit about them? How many people are there and are they wards? That kind of thing. And
Jess (08:53):
One of the elections.
Michelle (08:54):
Yeah, one of the, yeah,
Alex (08:56):
Love to, gosh, it’s such fun, but nobody ever asked me that.
Jess (09:00):
This is where we do the fun stuff. Alex
Alex (09:05):
Yp Township is divided into 19 precincts. Those 19 precincts, they cover two zip codes. 48, 1 98, 48, 1 97. It’s really important to think of like Ford Lake as a divider in Ypsilanti Township because north of Ford Lake is zip code 48, 1 98. South of it is zip code 48, 1 97. That southern part, it’s the most affluent part of Ypsilanti Township. But when you think 48, 1 97, it’s also that Ipsi City has that higher poverty rate. So in so many different spheres, when you’re looking at housing, criminal justice, health numbers, you need, those are a little bit diluted cause you’re having different demographic areas conflated when you look at zip code. But anyway, Ipsy Township 19 precincts, it’s governed by a seven member board of trustees. There’s actually four trustees and three officers, but that comprise the comprises the seven. They each have equal voting power. The four trustees are part-time. The three officers are full.
Alex (10:06):
The full-time is are the supervisor, the treasurer, and the clerk. The supervisor is Brenda Stubo. The treasurer is Stan Eldridge. The clerk is Heather Jarrell Rowe. The trustees are Gloria Peterson, Debbie Swanson, Jimmy Wilson Jr. And Johnny Newman. So those are the seven people. Just takes four to pass anything. A simple majority. So I think so much. And what I want to do here to and here in spaces like this is try to just demystify things a bit. So many people just try and trying to engage government, get things passed. They don’t know where to start. All these municipalities, you’re in Nipsey Township, it’s a seven member board of trustees, just going to need four people to vote your way. That’s it. I got
Jess (10:56):
Set a majority, majority of four people in constituency of 55,000 is interesting and sobering, really.
Alex (11:05):
Two to get Michelle and Molly, I’ll give you in a second, but Michelle, kind of the history, it’s really that Brenda Stumble is a supervisor and she’s part of the Stumble Dynasty. And I say that our, we don’t have a city hall, we have a convention center and that’s our civic center. And that’s on here on River Drive and Ipsy Township, it’s called the Tilden r Stumble Civic Center. And it’s named after a relative of hers. She, I’ve heard her say on different occasions, uncle and cousin, now it seemed he passed away recently that tr stumble. But talking to longtime residents, talking to professional historians, that family has a particular history in governing style. Part of that is staying out of that county discussion. I mean, there’s not a mystery that people don’t know that what Ipsy Township is that that current supervisor led a movement twice to try to change the name of Ypsilanti Township to Ford Lake Township to give you a kind of idea. And that can be Googled in on M Live. So there’s a particular governing style of staying out of those conversations. And the motto is a community of opportunity. You won’t see any mention of equity or serious equity discussion. You definitely won’t see Black Lives Matter. You don’t see many representatives from township government and a lot of our conversations that we’re all in, and it’s the second largest municipality in the county, in the center of so many disparities and issues that we all care about.
Michelle (12:42):
And you apparently don’t see even public comment about these things is what you were saying.
Alex (12:47):
Yeah, I say my favorite, I have a stencil. Ypsilanti Township officials cannot be reached for comment. That’s the most familiar reply
Alex (12:59):
That sure also see. And if people are aren’t familiar, I mean if you go to my Facebook page and look at and just search Brenda Stumble on things, I really do my best to, if I do my best to, in a witty, interesting way, point out to what the serious issues are, any of C township so people will remember and talk about them and hope it forces some type of discussion. But in our media void that it’s safer just to not comment, stay low. But that’s part of my hiatus is using social media better, which would be less, I think. And also being, that’s probably why I need to take a break because I’m getting, it pisses me off to have to do all this when people are getting paid. When people are getting paid. I shouldn’t have to create
Michelle (14:04):
And create is FaceTime. We don’t have to.
Alex (14:09):
So I need a break to keep my cheery self and come back for a minute. But it is a shame there’s a void. There’s all this conversation about these different issues, but you get into spaces with representatives and they’re clueless or just inherently resistant. I mean in my five years of advocacy here, it’s just painfully clear that you have to have clear proposals, you have to make an argument for it. You have to have support by it. And you have to have something for people to say yes to. And if there’s a no clear no and highlight it. So that’s direction I’m going in.
Jess (14:52):
Yeah. And speaking of that, I think Michelle had a question for you about a particular housing advocacy that you
Michelle (14:59):
Do. Well, yeah, I just wanted to talk about, because here on this show, we talk a lot about housing advocacy in Ann Arbor, but sometimes when I talk to people in different towns, it’s like, oh, you guys have different situations in terms of housing advocacy. And so I know what the problems are in Ann Arbor and I know how to advocate for them. But tell me about what housing advocacy looks like in Ipsy Township.
Alex (15:29):
I feel like it’s the Maytag repair man. I’m all
Michelle (15:38):
Well, tell us maybe what,
Alex (15:41):
What’s, go ahead.
Michelle (15:43):
Ask Michelle. Your volume disappeared again. Yeah, I guess my question is kind of like what are you trying to ask for and what would you help asking for?
Alex (15:57):
Well that understanding that besides Ypsilanti Township being the second largest municipality and having 55,000 people as opposed to Ipsy City 20,000, besides that, geographically it’s seven and a half times larger. So in terms of space in that housing discussion, there’s also part of Ypsilanti township’s governing style has, I don’t know the numbers, but there’s a significant amount of publicly owned land and Ypsilanti township’s government stance. And I can quote this is direct. And one of the few direct conversations that I had with Brenda Stubo, I, when I told, and I’m paraphrasing, but I had said that renters and homeowners are citizens and she is something to the effect, forget that I’m thinking about homeowners. That was her immediate, wow. That was her immediate response. And that’s reflective of Ipsy Township’s government governing style and voice in the housing discussion, which is stay out of it and point to the 2015 housing study, I believe, in which it said that more how more affordable housing is needed in Ann Arbor.
Alex (17:18):
And that there was an abundance. Now to answer I think directly what we need incidentally township government as an acknowledgement that housing’s a human. And that if they are going to rely on the county in those spaces to advocate for them, then you be there and advocate or something. Cause I think that’s what you would, I mean township officials, many would say that we’re a township, we have a different eng governing style. The county really will, they defer to the county in some of many spaces, which is a BS argument. Cause they don’t do anything with the, there’s not a strong discussion other than maybe a conversation or two between the supervisor and the county administrator. So there isn’t an advocacy on behalf of the township government to the county not in that housing space. What we need is that acknowledgement that housing is a human right, a human. And that Ipsy Township government needs to be part of that discussion about providing housing for our, and providing housing for all the people in Washington County.
Jess (18:28):
And will you remind me, Alex, you were talking a little bit ago about the supervisors and is it the trustees for the township? Yes. Will you remind me about the election cycles for those?
Alex (18:39):
Oh, thank you. Those are every four years. So just recently, just last 20 2020. And the opportunity, I really like two trustees that I, I’m confident that they have the Ipsy Township’s interest at best interest at art. But we don’t have a media and I’m one guy and Facebook and everything. So it’s about, but it’s every four years and it’s so important. It’s so many things in Washington Island County with respect to elections. It’s decided in August in the Democratic primary, that’s everything. And typically it’s been 15% turnout in those 19 precincts in Ypsilanti Township. So that everything that I said about Ypsilanti Township government, those dually elected officials, it’s with about 15% of the eligible democratic vote that puts them. It’s not representative of Ypsilanti Township people in my view. Cause they don’t even know they’re there. So
Jess (19:41):
For sure. And so what I’m hearing you say is that the next opportunity to press either the folks who are in office or candidates who may be running to declare their support for the idea that housing is a human, which feels like such a basic thing. And I’m actually not sure that Ann Arbor has said that. I don’t think we have. But to ask them to make that statement, the earliest possible opportunity for that in terms of elections is 2024. Am I hearing that right?
Alex (20:09):
Yep. Yes. With specific, specifically with Ypsilanti Township, yes. But there’s something the right now we’re in the midst of at the county level redistricting. And my hope at the end of that is Eastern Washington has more representation. We’ll see, right now we have nine members on the board of commissioners, nine districts and whatever amount that there will be that elections next year. And I’m a big fan of Justin Hodge and make sure he gets reelected. I don’t believe I’ve, that Ricky Jefferson is running again, I’d like to see someone more progressive, more unconnected to the regular status quo in that position. And if Ricky Jefferson doesn’t run again, I’m sure that machine will come up with some candidate. So we need someone an alternative, a real one. So it’s so next year and at the county level in terms of affecting Ypsilanti Township and people really need to pay attention to county redistricting and the August Democratic primary next year at county and make sure, and Alex Thomas likes Justin Hodge and somebody progressive and other seat. So those are the media ones.
Molly (21:28):
This county, thinking about it at the county level brings it to one of the things I wanted to ask you about, which is I know that you do some work around criminal justice and policing, I’m not going to say reform, but change, dismantling, abolition. And one of my understanding is that one of the big challenges to making substantive change here is just the sheer number of law enforcement agencies that are operating within a pretty small area. It’s something like 12 agencies because the campuses have their own. And there’s the thing you were talking about before, this sense of Ipsy actually encompasses a bunch of different places with different groups. And so I’m curious if you could talk a little bit about what you see as maybe some of the opportunities for change in the near future related to that election question or what you see as really the big issues if we’re not at the point of advocating. Yeah, well
Alex (22:23):
Thank you. Thank you. For my work in criminal justice, I was honored to be part of the original group of Liberate Don Incarcerate along with Anna Leer, Anna Leer, Maria Thomas, some Lauren, well, some really good great people. I was really proud to be in that through, in that process it became increasingly, I mean I just love all those folks that I was really more of a Eli guy than that ldi. So I kind of talking about prosecutor savi. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This was in the midst of the prosecutorial campaign and just in good faith and everything, it just seemed for me to, so I was started out with in the local liberation, don’t the local abolitionist group titled Liberation Don’t Incarcerate, and then became heavily involved in the Ellie Sabot campaign prior to Liberate Don’t Incarcerate. I became friends with Ellie Sabot and really encouraged him to run for prosecutor and had been organized with some other people to try to find a progressive candidate to run the prosecutor.
Alex (23:33):
So I was heavily involved in my, I think the very first involvement in politics for me was at 18 doing some door knocking for the Michigan Citizens lobby or something. I’m so used to losing the candidates. So Ellie SA winning the prosecutor’s race, that was just the, I mean that’s the pinnacle to finally win and to get a substantive person, I really believe like you did, and have so much impact. So I was incredibly involved with that campaign and then as one of his advisors in some of his different work groups and doing a lot. So that was my perspective on criminal justice as a resident here, it’s in incredibly passionate about between the ages of 16 and 24, I probably went to Wasaw County Jail seven or eight times for traffic related warrants. And in the probably pulled over 20 to 30 times fourth Amendment rights violated just consistently automatic in terms of searches and things.
Alex (24:44):
This is pre cammera, this is 19 84, 19 85. So just having that real personal experience was really just really passionate about and wanting to understand why in that work. You mentioned there’s 12 police agency law enforcement agencies in Washington County for Ypsilanti Township. It doesn’t have its own police force. It’s a contract with the Washington County Sheriff’s Department and there about, I think there’s 37 deputies that patrol, I’ve been pressing, one of the things that I’m working on, I know that there’s a quota system in Ypsilanti Township for citations. Deputies are expected to issue a one citation every four hours. And it’s a legal quota system because of that. Because lack of media, because of that close relationship between Atlanta Township and the Sheriff’s Department and the leadership and the reluctance of people that speak openly about it, and honestly it just stays in place. So that’s Ypsilanti Township’s court is 14 B, anything that’s, sometimes I get district and circuit confusion know the difference between, but at the Lola or 14 B District, district court, anything that’s not going to be a felony will stay there. But that’s Ypsilanti Township Court. 86% of its revenue that runs that court comes from cost and fines. And that’s ridiculously out of step with other areas in the county, the nation. And in gets a lot
Michelle (26:29):
Of bad incentives too.
Alex (26:31):
Yeah. To give you, there was a story on the national program, John Oliver, where they highlighted municipalities that depended on citation revenue and they did a few course that had 30% and they really highlighted one that got 60% of its revenue and Ypsilanti Township had 86%. If people Google Ypsilanti Township, Ann Arbor Observer, there’s a story on it, which is incorrect in the story. It highlights those numbers, but it says Ypsi Township government doesn’t contribute anything to the court budget. And I was told by a trustee that is false, that there is a certain percentage. So there’s a incentive for Ipsy Township to drive that citation. And with that matches my personal experience. But then when you look at the data with Landing Township and I gave you those numbers of 15% poverty race representing about 8,000 people, those are particular census tracks that, I mean they’re overly policed as it’s a lot of those, most of the citations are for, most of the citations are traffic related all. I’m not careful about putting the distinction between violent and non-violent, but all it’s there BS citations for that. Yeah, I mean
Molly (27:55):
Traffic enforcement, this is a place where I could go on for a long time about the problems of traffic enforcement as a, people talk about traffic enforcement as a way to make things safer, make our road safer. And it’s really mostly just a way to shake down certain members of our community.
Alex (28:14):
And to put a cap on it for me, like this summary where it trump, I mean in this equity discussion in law enforcement, the number one arrest for African-Americans in Washington Island County is obstruction of justice. Now, obstruction of justice is how, if you have a warrant for failure to pay a ticket that gets categorized as obstruction of justice. So that’s how I used to have it down. It’s either, it’s ridiculous disparity about, I really think it’s 12 times more likely as an African-American to have an, to be arrested for obstruction of justice. It’s the number one arrest for whites. It’s operating under the influence. But there’s incredible disparities all throughout criminal justice at our youth center, which is colloquially known as a juvenile hall for some of a certain age, but it’s our youth center for people that are for youth that have been arrested prior to Ellie SA and covid, typically there’s about 40 youth that were incarcerated there. Now it’s single digits, mainly because of Ellie Sabot not prosecuting those ridiculous probation violations and different things because he’s treating youth as youth. But,
Molly (29:34):
Oh, go ahead.
Alex (29:35):
Give example. 70% I, I’ve done some work and spoken to the staff there. I mean it’s just 70% of the youth that went through that detention center last year were from 48, 1 98 and 48, 1 97. So Sey Township in Ipsy City. So in that criminal justice equity discussion, that absence of Ipsy Township government being in there, that conflation of Ipsy City and Ipsy Township, that there’s a void and it puts this cloud of invisibility in this equity discussion and it’s ground zero for it.
Molly (30:15):
And so I’m looping it back to Ann Arbor because we’re the Ann Arbor AF podcast, but Ann Arbor votes for the Washtenaw County Sheriff. That’s actually something where we have a pretty direct action that we can be thinking about and looking to take is who we want to see in the leading the sheriff’s department. And it seems very clear that the Ellie’s election has had really great consequences. And it’s hard for me to imagine what someone would want or what I would want in a sheriff when I really, I want a whole different system. But elections are about choosing your opponent. And so I’m curious what you think about that piece.
Alex (31:01):
I can tell you, I know I’d want someone that’s in good faith at the table that wants true criminal justice reform and acknowledges and great guys. He might be, I don’t think Sheriff Jar Jerry Clayton is, I say that because I want a sheriff that’s totally focused on reducing the negative impacts of crime and not profiting from their position. Sheriff Jerry Clayton is the owner and founder of a law enforcement consulting company called the Cardinal Group too. They have contracts with different law enforcement agencies. They profit off of this system. I mean it’s legal, but I can’t say that if I’m sitting down at a table with someone that they’re invested in this criminal justice system that we’re really having an honest discussion because we’re not. And I think because of just political realities, the culture of Wasaw County government, people don’t hold them accountable or even talk about it and discuss it.
Alex (32:01):
So I mean from sincerely wanting to address these issues and good faith, it’s just really frustrating to get and how that plays out. Our neighborhood president organized a group of Ipsy township stakeholders as in the county commission and board of trustee members and some neighborhoods, some people from local nonprofits and those to address ordinance complaints, speeding and firecrackers and things. Someone had told me about it before and I said, it sounds like a bunch of older people about to piss off some kids. That’s what, because from my experience here, I mean there’s a lack of youth programming. There’s very little formalized to do. Before I was one of those kids as a teenager, Japanese back then, in my experience here, there’s been paintball, there’s been broken windows, there’s been, there’s not. So I mean the youth programming consistent and robust and by healthy people, that’s the addressing.
Alex (33:07):
But anyway, the, I accidentally was sent a zoom link to that, to the second meeting of that group and I saw the first meeting of it and in the first meeting the sheriff was coordinating it, it was facilitating it. And he said, this is a community problem. It’s going to be solved, needs to be solved by the community cause we’re going to do our job. And I’m like, I agree, why are you leading it? Why? So I couldn’t wait to be in the next Zoom. And when I was in the Zoom and I didn’t think I was crashing anything, I thought that the person sent it to me accidentally from another group that we’re in. And it was an accident, but I didn’t think I was Oh good. They invited me. Cool. But I started off by saying, I said everyone wants public safety, but not everyone likes law enforcement.
Alex (33:56):
And sheriff Jerry Clayton said Alex, I don’t know anyone that doesn’t like law enforcement. Oh no one, the only other person that backed me up that said something, they got the link accidentally either was someone that I also had encouraged them to run for Fsy Township supervisor Cheryl Roberts hopes she runs again, but she’s the one that spoke up too. And then I found, so it was an example, a realtime example of just seeing how law enforcement can co-op community discussions. And it’s really frustrating because as I said before, you don’t see EY Township government in a lot of these spaces. It was so cool to see all those Ipsy Township people in that zoom we could really talk about. And I think probably Molly, you want to talk about that more? I mean the answer is real. I think in that criminal justice space, the advocacy group has to do a better job of showing data informed community based solutions that reduce crime. And if not doing that, highlighting how more police hasn’t reduced crime
Jess (35:04):
And showing
Alex (35:04):
Insufficiency.
Jess (35:06):
I’m sorry to cut you off Alex. This reminds me of something that we are seeing a little bit in transportation planning and the language feels familiar and maybe we can port it over here where for a long time there’s been a conventional conversation around the three ease of transportation engineering, which is engineering. I don’t know if I’m going to get this right, education and enforcement. And the idea is that you make it teach people how to use it and you punish ’em when they do it badly. And we’re learning that this is really an equitable way of creating and maintaining a system of transportation. And so now there’s starting to be more conversation around the sixes and they’re folding in evaluation what you’re talking about, like measurable outcomes so that you can change the engineering, the system design, encouragement, and I think equity or equality depending on how it shows up. So it’s just interesting to me that the conversation around how we design equitable transportation infrastructures, whether it’s roads, it’s sidewalks, it’s bicycle lanes, it the way that you’re talking about criminal justice and law enforcement feels familiar to me even though it’s not an area that I spend a lot of time
Michelle (36:21):
And it sounds, I think, oh, I wanted to take a second to just go back and talk more explicitly about how people can get involved and where to put their pressure on. Because I know you talked about the sheriff’s department doing quotas and so if anyone in Washtenaw County can be pressuring the sheriff’s department about that and working at working on those elections and so forth. And then you talked about the court being insufficiently funded and funded only by fines. And I think that’s something that can be addressed. It sounds like you said Ipsy Township could be putting more funding towards the court, perhaps the county could as well. And then people can also pay attention to those judge elections perhaps. Is that reasonable?
Alex (37:12):
Yes. And I pointed out 14 b, there’s a new judge there and the past judge was representative of the past administration and the past administration’s candidate lost. I supported a judge Ira Washington and she’s the judge there. Well, a aware of this issue and it’s just a full, I mean I really like her and personally and also I know that she’s conscious of this issue, but having said all that, the community needs to be engaged around it. I guess I’d like to put out that I think she’s a partner in this discussion and she’s not representative of, for people that are just coming to this that are serious about it, she’s not representative of the past that created it and let it maintain and the campaign and our discussions by well aware of it. So there, there’s a real partner there, but it is something that county state funding, it’s a unique court that was set up. It has, but people have been aware of this for years. So just yes, attention on that. I wish, usually my answer was get in contact with me Michelle. So that’s why I’m positive. I’m trying to think before I put on,
Michelle (38:33):
Well maybe people too could get in touch with liberate don’t incarcerate. Are they working on that?
Alex (38:38):
They would be interested. Yeah. Okay. They, I am being
Michelle (38:44):
Very, we’ll put a link in the description for that group too.
Alex (38:49):
I, I’m taking a month or so off really in different and focusing at home. But I would like please go to my Facebook and read out on Messenger. Cause I would like to connect people. I don’t want to waste anyone’s time. And before I’d like to prep there, I can think of a few people that I may might be dying to hear from some people in each of those peers. I’d just like to check with them first. So I’d yeah, go to Alex Thomas Ypsilanti on Facebook. You’ll find you’ll see me and send me out a shout out on Messenger
Michelle (39:22):
And we can draw links in the description too. Yep, yep.
Molly (39:26):
I just wanted to highlight one more thing I heard you saying earlier, which was about the real absence of youth programming. So when we talk about the criminal justice system and policing, I think recently a lot of the conversation has been about defunding what we want to get rid of. And what I’m hearing you say is that there are things we need to build up and build more of than one of them is around resources and programming specifically for youth in Ipsy Township. And I’m wondering if you have organizations you like that are doing good stuff or other, that’s another area that people can be supporting in a different kind of way. Right now,
Alex (40:00):
I’ll put this out in my plans. When I do start becoming reactive, what I see as far as what I can personally do and in terms of my time is creating spaces for that’s at risk youth. It’s from the same areas that are be getting involved in the criminal justice system and there isn’t in programming. So I see the Ann Arbor Elks is African American large organization. I know a lot of quality people connected with it. If you talk to longtime residents of the county though they would like to see them to do more and to see them doing more and being connected. But I think creating my thought is creating opportunity for healthy people to engage with kids.
Alex (40:52):
Especially, I mean as soon as possible. But definitely junior high school, connecting the vocation, fun, just in the simplest terms. Getting health healthy people in spaces with healthy kids, creating healthy spaces with kids and not making it that something that I was doing. And then I will continue doing. I mentioned earlier that at the youth center down the single digits through some funding, myself and another person we visited there and we gave some gift certificates and some packets, some gift packets to the youth and talked to ’em for about an hour. And we try to connect any youth there, their families with services. But it’s just developing a judgment free relationship and letting ’em know what’s out there and maintaining that connection. I think a lot of people probably listening to this or in here, I’ve heard of the ADV Adver Adverse Childhood Experiences index.
Alex (41:57):
It’s for people that have it, it measures childhood trauma and the long-term health effects from it. And just so many of other youth, especially in the most difficult circumstances in standing accused of different crimes, childhood trauma’s there, childhood trauma’s there. And the one thing of the ones that resilience builders in that is having just one non-judgmental relationship with an adult that can have build so much resilience to that. So that’s trying to put some programming to that in the right way. Long term. That’s what needs to be here and that’s what other people that really want to affect things I think should think about.
Michelle (42:47):
Thank you. Yeah, I think that’s really helpful to know. So one thing I wanted to ask you about is that, I know you used to run a political interview show. I know you interviewed me and you interviewed Jess. Are you still doing that? What did you learn from that? What if you aren’t doing that anymore? What stopped you or what? Because I don’t know, I think we’re doing a podcast here. And what advice do you have for us?
Alex (43:18):
Well, thank you. And those are all great questions. I’m on a hiatus from doing it, so I haven’t been doing it regularly. Covid really stopped me that just presented challenges. But even while not doing that consistent show, whenever there was opportunities to highlight different issues, I would do that. And so I’ve had a social media presence. I did a weekly show for the audience called the Alex Thomas Show out of, I would record from my laptop out of Riverside Arts Center. Just people that were concerned with the Ipsi area and from organizations that were doing things in it. Michelle was a guest, Jessica was a guest.
Alex (44:04):
Michelle what? I feel so blessed. It was an incredible learning experience. It was like awesome for some of, because I was able to just free flow, ask the questions I was interested in and see the common themes, see the different perspectives. It was just a really unique view. So I just, what I learned so much, what I learned so much, but I think biggest is that there’s real, there’s a community of concern, people that really working to make Washington County, Ipsy Ann Arbor better. But because of the evolution in our society as far as how people get information, avoiding media, social media, these, they’re inside the silos in different areas and there’s not enough communication among them in a coalition among those groups on the same side. I mean this Washington County is not that large. So that’s what I just needs to be better, more, better connect, better connection, better communication. That’s what I’d say I’ve learned for advice. I’m doing a pocket, just what you guys are doing. Be consistent. Be consistent, and stay ahead of yourself as best you can. That makes it easier. But keep it going.
Jess (45:21):
I bet you guys, I am, first of all, I’m having a great time. And second of all, I feel so lucky to have Alex here. It’s really fun. Alex, you and I have worked together and talked together and played together for years now, and it’s just fun to know other people in the community who are paying attention to the spreadsheets that get produced by our respective municipalities or not, and the ones that we put together because we’re missing the data. You say you didn’t do any homework for this interview and I know that you didn’t. And yet exactly how many precincts and the population and exactly the election cycles, the things that we know for your home. And I just, I’m deeply, deeply enjoying that. So I’m glad you’re here with us. You’ve referenced a couple of times and I just kind of want to call it out, the hiatus that you’re taking.
Jess (46:09):
So listeners, you can hear how busy Alex is and how much he knows and he’s taking a little bit of time for himself. And I think that’s an important part too of this work, right? Is what’s the Banksy quote, learn to rest, not to quit. And Alex, I’m super grateful not only that you are making a small exception to come here for this conversation, but that you are prioritizing your health, your happiness, your play, I hope in the time that you’re taking off. So I have. Thank you. Yeah. I have one more question for you before we let you go back out into this glorious weather today. So this is Ann Arbor af and obviously you are here as a huge Ipsy Township booster. And I love that our communities get to be neighbors to each other. In talking to the people who listen to this show, I wonder what do you want us to know? What do you want our listeners to know?
Alex (47:03):
I think I would like your listeners to know if you’re concerned about equity, if that means something to you. And if you consider yourself in that community of concern, people in the county, then educate yourself about how equity plays out in this area. And if you do that, then you’re going to find yourself studying Ypsilanti Township, superior Township, Pittsfield Township in the city of Ipsy. And studying that would mean looking at what’s on the agenda in those respective representatives bodies and seeing are they discussing equity? What’s that equity situation look like within those borders? How do they feel about Black Lives Matter? How engaged is that body? Because all politics are local. And I think what I’ve seen, I was fortunate, I was overseas for eight years and I was able to save some money. I knew I was coming back, I was able to do what I wanted, but cut Not a lot of people in Ypsilanti Township.
Alex (48:15):
And a lot of people affected by these equity issues are, and they’re not in these spaces. So a lot of your Ann Arbor residents that care about equity, they do have the resources in terms of time and energy and educational background to really impact these. And I think there’s a responsibility with that. I expect a little more from my Ann Arbor folks. I I’ve seen, because Michelle asked me about the Ypsilanti Township housing advocate. I don’t know. There’s Sey Township Housing Advocacy Group, there’s Sey City that I’m really proud to be associated with. But they work and they’re tired and they don’t have as much time as a lot of the Ann Arbor folks and they don’t come as well rested as I see a lot of the Ann Arbor folks that I see. So I guess I would like your readers that care about these issues, to use those resources. And even if it’s just time and that experience and that privilege that they do have to rise to the occasion, accept that responsibility and come to these spaces and represent those areas and those issues
Jess (49:29):
That is as powerful a call to action that I can imagine. And a really lovely place to stop. Alex, I’m so glad to be your friend and a colleague in this space. Thank you for joining us today.
Alex (49:40):
Oh, it’s been my pleasure. It’s been my pleasure.
Molly (49:49):
And that’s it for this episode of Ann Arbor af. Come check out our episodes and transcripts at our website, ann arbor af.com. Keep the conversation going with fellow Ann Arbor AF listeners on Twitter at the A2 Council hashtag and Facebook in the Ann Arbor, humans Who wonk group and catch cohost Michelle on wcbn.org. Tuesdays 9:00 AM or 6:00 AM to 9:00 AM It’s mostly music made by women, but also the occasional council recap. And hey, if you wanted to send us a few dollars@kofi.com slash ann Arbor AF to help us with hosting, we always appreciate it. We are your co-hosts, Michelle Hughes, Jess Leeta, and myself Molly Klein. And thanks to producer Jack Jennings. The music is, I don’t know by Grapes. You can reach us by email at ann arbor af pod gmail.com. Get informed, then get involved. It’s your city.